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Message #1618 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  All
From:  
Jaydawg  
Subject:  Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/07/06, 10:08am
Here's the reason why a salary cap in baseball is a necessity. The way the system is set up now, Kansas City and Tampa Bay don't have a legitimate shot at putting out a contender. Every offseason, George Steinbrenner gets the best players money can buy and then some. But, does his team win it all every year? NO!!! The two teams in the '05 World Series (Astros & White Sox) were ranked 12th and 13th in payroll. A salary cap is a MUST in order to have an even playing field for all teams.

Now that baseball has the steroid problem under control, it's time for Bud Selig and the powers that be to do something about the out of control payrolls for big-market teams. Even if you live in a small-market, it doesn't mean that you're entitled to a team that's low on talent.

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Message #1620 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Jaydawg
From:  
Guest4889 (IP: 68.59.55.101)  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/7/06, 11:46am
I completely agree! Something definately has to be done. I think it would only improve major league baseball for every team.

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Message #1626 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Jaydawg
From:  
Guest4900 (IP: 67.81.156.61)  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/7/06, 2:09pm (Last Edited: 1/7/06, 2:20pm)
"The way the system is set up now, Kansas City and Tampa Bay don't have a legitimate shot at putting out a contender."

They don't have a legitimate shot because those teams are horribly mis-managed. Check out the depth of talent in KC's farm system... THE YANKEES have more prospects.

"Every offseason, George Steinbrenner gets the best players money can buy and then some. But, does his team win it all every year? NO!!! The two teams in the '05 World Series (Astros & White Sox) were ranked 12th and 13th in payroll."

Ok, you can't say that low budget teams don't succeed then point out that the World Series was contested by two mid-budget teams. This is proof that a big payroll isn't a benefit, and rather that the secret to success is good management in the front office and on the field.

"A salary cap is a MUST in order to have an even playing field for all teams."

I'm sorry, no. You just proved that it isn't. Why do you want one so bad again? Jealous of the Yankees roster? Just because you spend a lot doesn't mean you get what you pay for. You can't buy chemistry...

Look at Giambi, not worth even close to his salary. How about Kevin Brown, Pavano, Kenny Lofton, Tony Womack.. etc, etc. A salary cap won't really even the playing field because salary isn't determined by your worth, it's determined by how many Ferrarri's Scott Boras wants to buy this year.

If you want an even playing field, eliminate free-agency. Kill it dead. Trades would still be all good. Maybe even allow one year of free-agency on a player's 30th birthday or something. Homegrown talent draws fans more than free agents do. Look in the stands at Yankee Stadium this summer. Check out the jerseys and t-shirts people are wearing -- count the A-Rod's and Giambis. THEN count the Jeters and the Bernie's, I promise those homegrown players have more support (even if most of the Jeter's are young girls with a crush on him -- it still counts).

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Message #1627 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4900 (IP: 67.81.156.61)
From:  
Jaydawg  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/7/06, 2:53pm
I respectfully disagree with a few points there. Despite a few flaws, free-agency is fine for the most part. Why should all the owners keep all of the dough and prevent players in having any say in their own contracts? Imagine what Steinbrenner would've been like if he owned the Yankees before the Curt Flood case. YIKES!!!!
Baseball salaries are up through the stratosphere now, so that's the main reason why the game needs a salary cap badly. Low-budget teams don't necessarily have a lack of talent in their minor league systems. For instance, Kansas City has produced George Brett, Bret Saberhagen, and Johnny Damon, among others. All I'm saying is that loyal fans in small-market towns deserve a shot at competitive teams. Take the NBA, for example. Their low-budget teams, such as San Antonio, Detroit, and Portland are normally among the hottest teams in the league, with the same free-agency rule, I might add. Why do the Spurs enjoy a similar playing field as the Lakers? It's all about the salary cap.....

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Message #1629 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4900 (IP: 67.81.156.61)
From:  
drrubb  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/7/06, 6:39pm
Brown, Pavano, Lofton, & Womack would be stars on a small market team. Come on, seriously man! The Yanks have Damon,Jeter,Arod,Sheffield,Giambi,Matsui. The Royals have, ah, well, ah ................. I can't think of anybody. Sweeney maybe? Give me a freakin break man! The Yankees are the best team money can buy. Give the Yankees the Royals or Devil Rays salary cap & see how you do. Then come back & whine to me how the system is fine. Let's talk about farm systems by the way. Just because some of the small market teams might have good farm systems, don't mean they are going to reap the benefits. Here's why. Even if a super major league prospect comes up through the minors through a small market organization, the small market teams won't be able to keep them after a year or two because they don't usually have the money to keep that prospect around, especially if he is a hot prospect who blossoms quickly. Then someone like the Yankees comes along & snags him because they can more than afford him. What sucks about this is that the small market team developed the prospect, then they don't really get to enjoy the fruits of their hard labor because the Yankees flex their financial muscle & Steinbrenner opens up his bottomless checkbook.

The other problem here is that the Yankees trick these small market teams by giving them prospects from their farm system in return for the small market team's star players. It might seem like a decent deal on paper for both sides at the beginning, but a couple of years lator, the Yankees turn right around & go back after those hot prospects they traded away to those small market teams a couple of seasons prior, after the small market teams have gone to the trouble of further developing these blossoming players. The Yankees just get them back when they become ripe because the small market teams can't afford to keep them around. The system SUCKS! The Yankees monopolize everything & just because the Yankees don't when the World Series every year doesn't mean they are not in the running to win it every season because of their money. They only know how to buy championships. I would like to see them win a World Series with the Royals or Devil Rays salary. There needs to be a salary cap!

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Message #1633 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  drrubb
From:  
Guest4913 (IP: 68.85.175.96)  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/7/06, 10:32pm (Last Edited: 1/8/06, 12:38pm)
MY POINT is that it's not about the friggin' salaries. Its about how well your team is managed.

A lot of small market teams are mismanaged. The brewers used to cut payroll and live off the revenue sharing (and make money doing it -- forget being competitive). The Royals fucked up their own farm system, and don't make the most of their major league roster either. Look what the marlins did this year.

LOTS of small market teams can be competitive. The A's usually are. Ever been to a Braves game? No crowd, but they still win. Etc. Etc. Etc.

The point? Its not about how much you're paying players, it's how you manage the team.

In basketball you have five men playing at a time. A salary cap is easier to manage with a basketball roster than with a 40-man MLB roster. Good teams know how to draft and recruit players from abroad. They get good coaches/managers and play good baseball. They develop players and they win.

Once again, before you guys miss the point, i'll mention Oakland. They are ALWAYS a good team with good players.

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Message #1635 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4913 (IP: 68.85.175.96)
From:  
drrubb  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/8/06, 7:39am
I see your point to an extent, but we can only agree to disagree.

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Message #1639 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4913 (IP: 68.85.175.96)
From:  
Jaydawg  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/8/06, 12:59pm (Last Edited: 1/8/06, 1:00pm)
What about the NFL? They also have the salary-cap rule and they manage just fine. The Indianapolis Colts are the odds on favorite at this point to win the Super Bowl. If the NFL had the same type of astronomical salaries as baseball, the Colts wouldn't stand a chance. Under that scenario, the N.Y. Giants would be led by a Manning named Peyton, not Eli. Something is obviously wrong in Major League Baseball when the number 2 team in salary (Red Sox) is $90 million behind the Yankees in payroll. Not too long ago, small-market clubs like the Reds and Royals were able to compete with anybody in the leagues. Then, salaries went out of control during the '90's and the game hasn't been the same since. Sure, bad management is a factor, but it's difficult to compete with a team that has unlimited power to get the best players money can buy. As Dr. Rub said, medium-market teams can compete sometimes, but teams like Kansas City and Tampa Bay don't stand a chance anymore under the current system. By the way, the Oakland A's aren't exactly a small-market team. The San Francisco Bay Area is a whole lot larger than Kansas City or Cincinnati. Now that baseball has solved the steroid problem, it's time for Bud Selig and company to do something about the out of control salaries before teams like the Royals and D-Rays would be forced to move elsewhere.

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Message #1643 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Jaydawg
From:  
drrubb  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/8/06, 7:29pm
Preach on Jaydawg! You are dead on in my book! I completely agree with your stance. I couldn't have said that any better myself.

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Message #1647 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Jaydawg
From:  
Guest4976 (IP: 67.81.156.61)  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/9/06, 2:06pm
The A's aren't small-market, but they are small-budget.

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Message #1649 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4976 (IP: 67.81.156.61)
From:  
Jaydawg  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/9/06, 7:15pm
The Oakland A's had a 2005 payroll of approximately $55,869,262. That's not exactly a small-budget team, is it? They're not even close to the Yankee payroll, but who is? Overall, the A's are right up there with the medium-market teams in size and payroll. Of course, it helps in having a baseball genius like Billy Beane as their GM. If you click the article from this post, you'll see for yourself that the 2005 teams with the lowest budget are the Tampa Bay D-Rays ($26.6 mil.) and the Pittsburgh Pirates ($30.1 mil.).

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Message #1654 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Jaydawg
From:  
Guest4976 (IP: 67.81.156.61)  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/9/06, 11:25pm
If there is a salary cap, it won't change the spending habits of mid-budget teams though. They form the majority. So you cut the payrolls of the Yankees, Redsox, Mets and Phillies, everyone else stays the same. The D-Rays will still be way cheaper than everyone else. They'll still lose. Unless they get a genius like Billy Beane.

Caps have intricacies like cap penalties that are hard to manage as well. Teams that have good management right now (mid or small-market) could end up marginalized by that.

And seriously, the A's left KC for a reason. The Marlins are leaving florida for a reason. The Devil Rays should leave Tampa for that reason. Honestly there are prob. too many baseball teams already.

In europe for soccer they have multiple leagues with promotion and relegation between them. It ensures that each team can compete. Teams in small towns are usually competitive in the lower leagues, but they can have a good year and move up to face tougher competition. If you want to have a pro-team in your hometown, this is what we should do.

A cap won't create more baseball fans in Tampa. It won't increase Tampa's population, it won't make it a bigger TV market, it won't level that playing field at all.

In football, almost all of the games are covered under national league-wide agreements. In football all of the teams have similar revenue streams from broadcast media therefore. Also, its' popular in all of the cities where they have teams, so sellout crowds are common, even when a team is awful.

The Jets sold out the Meadowlands (and nobody showed up, but still) and had the 4th worst season in football.

Baseball is a capitalist sport. It's possible to win without spending 100million, but you have to develop young talent and generate enough revenue to support a competitive payroll. The luxury tax actually does more to help teams like TB than a cap would. Right now, a big chunk of their payroll is paid for by the Yankees through lux. tax. If there's a cap, they don't get that revenue.

Salary caps keep football competitive, yes, but Football is a different beast.

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Message #1656 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  Guest4976 (IP: 67.81.156.61)
From:  
drrubb  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  1/10/06, 6:50am
Cutting the payrolls of teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, & Mets, I believe is the ultimate goal here really. That would atleast bring those teams down back towards the middle somewhat, although I'm sure they would definately be the upper middle just because of the market they are in. Fans of the New York Yankees are just spoiled & have been a very long time obviously because of all that money they have. Even if there was a salary cap, unfortunately the Yankees would still make money because of the YES Network, sales of Yankee merchandise,etc. People will buy Yankee merchandise for fashion statements even if they are not baseball fans. There are too many damn bandwagon Yankee fans out there as well, because the main stream media makes them very GQ & glamourous & sexy. Glamour & sex always sales. A lot of the problem is the media. If the media keeps stuffing the Yankees in people's ears, these naive people out there jump on their bandwagon. I still believe there needs to be a salary cap, because the Yankees monopolize baseball. The media promotes them & they just continue to feed the beast that is the NY Yankees. This is why I hate the Yankees so damn much. I hate the main stream media as well because they do not promote the rest of baseball & all of the other major league baseball teams near as much as they do the Yankees. The media has their nose too far up the Yankees ass. This is part of the gigantic problem that allows the Yankees to stay at the very top because they are constantly generating revenue because they are always in the news because the media makes them top priority. Again, this is just part of the problem! If the media would quit promoting the Yankees SO DAMN MUCH, & start promoting & talking about all of the other baseball teams more, maybe the other teams could rise in stature & quit being the black sheeps of major league baseball. The way it is now, it is the Yankees, maybe the Red Sox, & all of their farm league teams which is the rest of baseball.

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Message #3216 of 6634  *NEW*
To:  All
From:  
ap_donovan  
Subject:  Re: Yankees Finished '05 Season With A Record $207.2 Million Payroll
Date:  4/25/06, 3:45pm
For all who have posted that a salary cap is a necessity in baseball i praise your words. I myself am from Toronto, born and raised. So naturally I have become a BlueJays fan. Well concidering i was born early 1990 i don't even remember the 92/93 WS, and ever since then i've got to watch the Yankees and Red Sox (for a little bit the Orioles) take a hold on not just the AL East but the whole division. Im not just saying this because im a Canadian kid crying over our lower dollar prices but really, traditionally small market teams such as the Jays don't stand a chance year in year out. Until now...I hope

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